(imported from my tumblr)
13 October 2025
stonesense: this is going to make me sound insane and nitpicky but do you ever feel like sometimes in fanart when people draw male characters they go out of their way to capture their unique facial features and then when they draw female characters they draw like a generic woman face and call it a day
13 October 2025
stonesense: please ignore how i started this post i’ve been vindicated by everyone in the notes and i now feel confident enough to say i am not insane and nitpicky and also we should attack people with hammers
13 October 2025
lesbianzombie: we shant forget the ancient texts
16 Oct 2025
mamalaw1021:
And my reply from 22 October 2025:
This is one way that Don Bluth wins. The bar is in hell but he's hopping over it most of the time. I'm going to do a breakdown of every female character in Thumbelina first, because wow there's a lot of them, and they are VARIED--and not just because most of them are bugs! But also MOST OF THEM ARE BUGS!! That's incredible.
Credits: all screencaps from Thumbelina are from here. They have screencaps of most animated films, they started with Disney and expanded from there. They do have all of Don Bluth, in case anyone after me wants to add on with other Don Bluth films. I can only do Thumbelina bc that's the movie I have memorised, so I know where to look. Anyway let's get started!
While Thumbelina looks very "disney princess-y", the Queen of the Fairies has quite a wonderful, striking face:
And as you can see, her crown is basically the same as the King's!
This is a doe rabbit:

And all through the movie, the female characters are just as cartoony as the male ones. It's great! One of the reasons I love this film. And you can say what you want about how much "Don Bluth loved a fat MILF with a big rack" but that isn't ALL his female characters, either. He knows how to draw the typical pinup, which to me proves it's a CHOICE, that it's on purpose when he does something like this:

and not just "this is the only kind of woman he can draw". (The above is Princess Daphne, the McGuffin from the ARCADE game Dragon's Lair in 1983; Don Bluth did the only cel-animated arcade games ever made).
Okay, let's get back to Thumbelina: What gender do you think the biggest bird is?

Did you guess "boy"? That's Jacquimo, the Harlequin swallow!! Also check out how the chickadee can-can dancers don't have titties! (did I mention this movie technically takes place in the French countryside?) Anyway, here's some more female characters from Thumbelina. First up, The Jitter Bugs!:
It's hard to get the little girl Jitterbug singularly, but she's the one in the red cape. Side note all the jitterbugs are based on not real bugs but bugs from early animation, particularly Merrie Melodies. Here's a big shot of not just the Jitterbugs, but Mr and Mrs Fish as well, the female bugs have pretty much the same faces as the males:

Here's a better shot of the Fishes:

And you can see a female snake, fish, and frog in this group shot:

Mrs Toad can be forgiven her character design, because her voice actress is Charo, and the design is meant to look like her, and yes Charo was known for her titties as well, I just can't find a good photo that showcases the signature hairstyle and the titties.
And the sequence below is an homage to The Ugly Bug Ball!
Notably, in this sequence, our Princess heroine gets called UGLY, because the bugs have different beauty standards than humans!
Here's Mrs Fieldmouse:
(I'm not sure what species of thing that is beside Mrs Fieldmouse, it looks like a bug lady of some kind.)
The three French Hens and oh my god I just now got the joke:

And, finally, Tumbelina's mother, the only human in this movie (and she has no name other than Mother), is allowed to be fat and have a double-chin:

So yeah, that's I think every female character in the film. Oh, whoops, I forgot one--Thumbelina!
Ok so like, WHY. Why is it like this NOW, when Thumbelina came out in 1994? What happened? What changed? Well, it's a combination of things. Let's get into it.
First, Hollywood execs are VERY thin-skinned, and not used to knowing what every single audience member thinks. It used to be that the only way they could tell what the audience thought was ticket sales and focus group screening questionnaires. With social media, everyone can leave a review for a movie, everyone can make their review public. That's a lot of opinions. We all who live on the internet, and some of us who were raised here, know how harsh and opinionated and mean the internet can be. Well the execs don't. They're not used to it. They're delicate.
Plus they, ALSO, were not aware, UNTIL the internet, of Rule 34.
In fact, NOBODY knew about Rule 34 until the internet happened. See, the internet is a very interesting place. It's everywhere and nowhere. It's a huge, huge amount of people, more people gathering in one "spot" than ever before, and so a few truths--which have always BEEN--were suddenly visible. Like Rule 34. Gather enough people, and you start to realise that everything is a kink to at least ONE person. But you need to gather up millions of people in order for Rule 34 to consistently prove itself. Nobody knew about it until the internet, and the Hollywood execs and media censors I mean MPAA didn't know about it until the past 10, maybe 15 years.
So Hollywood panicked. PANICKED, are still panicking. They really do not know how to deal with audience doing more than just being empty vessels that dispense money as their only form of having an opinion or free will. They don't understand that you cannot control Rule 34, it's not a rule we agreed to, it's a scientific theory sort of rule. It's like gravity, or inertia. It just HAPPENS. They don't get it. And they try and control it. And one of the ways they control sexuality is controlling women--I mean, female characters.
But this isn't just a CGI thing, this is a fight that's been going on at Disney for years. Eisner and Disney generally find Jessica Rabbit "too hot" and that is why there's very little merchandise of her or of the film (since she's such a huge role), and why they will never greenlight more Roger Rabbit films. So this isn't new. Women who have flesh that jiggles or heaves or is at all ANYTHING is "too hot". Even in adult animation, when was the last time you saw a woman's body jiggle except when that's the entire focus of a gag?
But in recent years, there has been even more panic surrounding how female characters are viewed. E-surance stopped using Erin after they found out people thinks he's hot. Wow, imagine that. People think a character designed to be attractive is attractive. But it got worse the longer the internet was around, and that eventually even led to nasty things that made it EVEN WORSE, like FOSTA-SESTA in 2018.
But you can't stop Rule 34 any more than you can stop children liking repetitive annoying songs. It's just a rule of humanity. People have kinks. But that coming out publicly and being known? That just threw into stark light how incredibly puritanical Hollywood still is about sex. Particularly animation, which is seen as "for children only", the idea that adults might find animated characters worthy of porn is idk terrifying? To the sort of person in control of what female characters look like.
There's also this weird reaction to demanding female characters be more than just princesses and pin ups. That's a reasonable demand, but the reaction to it from Hollywood was so incredibly deranged. "stop making women all thin hourglasses with tits and ass, women come in more shapes than that" well they heard the first part but ignored the second one. Feminist Character Designs have NO titties and NO poofy lips! No makeup! Short hair! No fat! Nothing objectionable! Nothing sexual! You can't possible sexualise a woman without any of that, right?
Rule 34: Oooou MILF with the dumptruck ass!!! Hawt!!!
Hollywood: WELL WHAT IF NOBODY HAD ANY CURVES AT ALL?? SURELY THAT WILL FIX IT!!! #Feminismwin!
Rule 34: Haha hold my beer.
So mostly, the Puritanical USian attitude that we not only can but SHOULD control people's sexuality, that people SHOULD NOT HAVE SEXUAL FEELINGS AT ALL EVER IN RESPONSE TO ART is what is driving this, as is the frankly utterly naive non-understanding of the CULTURE of the internet, and of the FOURTH WALL. Even Hollywood has forgotten the fourth wall was there to protect THEM from US.
AND, added to all of this, there is the element of vulture capitalism, of the "profit must grow every quarter or you're failing", of "we have to appeal to the lowest common denominator" (thanks disney for setting that shitty standard!), and of animation being seen as being for younger and younger audiences as we adultify children younger and younger by various means, including but not limited to: viewing children existing outside as criminal, loitering laws, helicopter parenting, school shootings, and other systemic abuses of children.
I will not go into detail but I will mention here also the rise in Fundementalism and the fact that Hollywood could suddenly hear about those nutjobs and that the nutjobs could talk to one another and organize bullshit but that makes me very angry to think about.
It is all of these elements, TOGETHER, that have created this problem.
This is very long so I am going to close with:
You can't have good art without there being something sensual allowed. Art depicts all the aspects of life, including the flesh. If you eliminate the fleshy aspects of life, you eliminate all that makes something visually relatable and appealing to look at. You eliminate the ability to caricature, which is a staple of animation. People are not sexless plastic dolls. People are made of meat. Art needs to be made of meat, also, if you catch my meaning.